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Babiana for Delegate of the EP
Topic Started: May 29 2013, 02:15:26 PM (1,634 Views)
Babiana
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The Candy Man
Shall I compare me to a mean old man?
I am newer and more random.
I knew I had to post this by the end of May
I've been putting it off every day
So here's a wordplay for a roleplay
Elaborating on my take on gameplay
"Erm, don't merely concatenate rhymes" folks say,
With consternation, "Writing doesn't work that way!"
Well I've aimed for increasing my endocount
We shall see who has the greater amount
It's not to catch you all unawares
But, a backdrop of activity, with which
A cacophony of silly ideas I'll try to pitch,
From separation of powers to foreign affairs
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God-Emperor
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Mool-Tee-Pass
If ya don't win, I'll create and get ya elected to the position of Poet Laureate.
Posted ImageThe Fourth Imperium
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
Ok, as many of you know, I've been involved with EPSA. Our latest mission was in The Imperial League where we initiated closure of its embassy with GGR. It met with opposition from foreign forces, and then we withdrew to TEP to focus on this election. Two of our soldiers, Dimiou and Tano, are still there assisting The Pacific in holding the region, so spare a thought for them, in between the very important role as citizens we have in concentrating on this election to ensure it goes well.

On my return to TEP I rejoined the WA, accepted the nomination for delegate and endorsed every WA member in TEP except four. It's been just over 76 hours and my endocount is now 79. Which, incidentally, is one less than the endocap.

Every time I say or do something you disagree with, withdraw your in-game endorsement from Babiana. When I say or do something to redeem myself, or if you want me to be delegate, then place your WA endorsement on Babiana. If your WA nation is not in TEP, move it to The East Pacific so you can take part, I will keep you updated in this thread.

Plus there will be policies, alongside a little random rambling.
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
God-Emperor
May 29 2013, 02:25:44 PM
If ya don't win, I'll create and get ya elected to the position of Poet Laureate.
I've been winning a little bit each day since you came back into my life.

Still 79.
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
79. I would be happy to answer any questions you may have.

Separation of Powers: I believe this is very important, and I completely agree with the independence law that ASBS introduced. I will make sure not to enter the Magisterium. I had an idea recently, that the government structure could be improved by abolishing the conclave. This sounds like a radical step, but you will notice that the arbiters do nothing. I mean no disrespect, as I hold all four members in high regard, I only mean that FPS and SY appeared to do nothing as arbiters. The functions of the conclave can be transferred to the magisterium via an amendment to the concordat. I'll leave the Magisterium to draft such a proposal, as that is their remit. See? This shows my commitment to separation of powers as I am leaving it in their hands, not involving myself in legislating. Powers that are unsuitable to move to the Magisterium, such as removal of magisters, could be transferred to the viziers instead. For each trial or review, the magisterium could have a process in place to designating a magister to preside and carry out that function in the magisterium, for example, the magisterium would elect a magister to act as judge and the remaining magisters would act as jury. The advantage of this system is it would empower the magisterium and promote more activity within it, it would also allow potential arbiters to be involved in the buzz of normal magister work. This would end the current atmosphere that citizens can do whatever they want as the hopelessly understaffed conclave is never going to catch up with them for violating the law. By bringing it inside the Magsterium, the relative strength of the judiciary can be increased or decreased democratically as required, providing greater flexibility and greater distinctiveness for the EP. It would also be a step toward re-implementing magisterial elections, as an enhanced magisterium is better placed to do that.
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
79 still taking questions, don't be shy.

Foreign Affairs.

Except for the UDL and Lazarus... I would withdraw all in-game embassies, close of our offsite embassies and recall and dismiss all TEP ambassadors, and notify all foreign envoys that the foreign affairs programme as been shut down. Then I would review our current treaties, which as far as I have been told is the UDL and Lazarus, and solicit comments from the magisterium as to which of those treaties they wish to keep. I would also request the magisterium to collectively (by some form of vote which would preserve individual responses) sit the Gameplay Alignment Test, and publish its results in full. I would use the results of that test to formulate foreign policy for the next six months, particularly with regards to The United Defenders League.
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A Slanted Black Stripe
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You have some intriguing ideas.

I'm surprised you support the legislation I introduced in the Magisterium, as it has not been very popular with anyone else. But I do thank you for the support.

I was not familiar with the Gameplay Alignment Test before reading your message. So I took the test and posted the results in the thread in our forum. Already there are quite a mix of responses.

How would you combine these scores to formulate a foreign policy?

I'm also surprised by your suggestion to eliminate the Conclave. Based on what I have seen, we have citizens who claim that actions of the Magisterium are in violation of the Concordat, but no one seems willing to present a case to the Conclave. I think the Conclave could be quite busy if the citizens utilized them.

If there were no Conclave, how would citizens challenge laws they thought were in violation of the Concordat? The Magisterium is not going to be an unbiased judge of its own actions.

Thanks.

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Tano
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It's all good man.
I don't think eliminating the conclave is a good idea. We should instead try to fill those spots with active, experienced citizens or magisters.

I also would like to know, what kind of future do you invision for EPSA? What kind of role would you like the army to play in the future of our region?

And finally, would you go in depth about different cultural events you might have planned?
Thanks.
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A Slanted Black Stripe
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One of your opponents stated he would increase the endo count limit to 100. You seem quite excited about endo counts. What would you do with the current endo count limit as delegate?
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
A Slanted Black Stripe
May 30 2013, 01:53:49 AM
One of your opponents stated he would increase the endo count limit to 100. You seem quite excited about endo counts. What would you do with the current endo count limit as delegate?
I'm excited about everything.

When the endocap question was raised by Todd a few weeks ago, I quietly gave my opinion that it was perfectly fine as it was, 80. I would be happy for it to change if that be the will of the region. It depends on what we are trying to achieve. If we want to use it to control the WA delegacy, and curbing the influence of the natives and would-be intruders, then a much lower endocap is the way to go. If we want a fully permissive and freedom-loving society where there is no restraint on exchanging endorsements, then abolishing the endocap is the way to go. 80 is an acceptable balance between the two extremes. Imposing such any such rule may be uncomfortable for some nations, but sometimes imposing the culture of TEP on the residents could be seen as a positive thing. We need to be accepting of other residents sharing their own national culture with us too: we ought to embrace theirs if we expect them to embrace our own rules.
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
Tano
May 29 2013, 08:13:18 PM
I don't think eliminating the conclave is a good idea. We should instead try to fill those spots with active, experienced citizens or magisters.

I also would like to know, what kind of future do you invision for EPSA? What kind of role would you like the army to play in the future of our region?

And finally, would you go in depth about different cultural events you might have planned?
Thanks.
I respect your view and I'm glad that the conclave is an institution that you value. The delegate wouldn't have the authority to abolish it, but I put it forward as an alternative structure that I would love to see, if the region came round to the idea.

Edit: In answer to your third question, I would develop a complete calendar that would complement and incorporate the regional holidays that are currently in the process of being passed into law. There are things that I've considered and would connect them with the calendar and with any willing roleplay elements that our citizens could contribute:

1. Changing the WFE into a chessboard and playing a match of Tim vs The East Pacific - citizens would post moves on the RMB and the board would be updated with theirs and Tim's moves.

2. Recruitment drive for the Greenwood Band. (This depends on whether our relations with UDL crash and burn or not)

3. Transpacific boat race. Citizens would register a boat in the form of a puppet state and compete in a race around the pacifics.

4. Religious rituals and festivities.

5. I haven't prepared a list but am excited about possibilities.


In answer to your second question: The army is primarily for two things, attacking and protecting. The character of our army is Independent. This is one of six alignments, raider region, moderate raider, defender region, bi-gameplay region, neutral and independent. A full explanation of these types was written by Unibot in his essay Paradise Found. Independent means to TEP that we do not belong to either end of the R/D spectrum. The difference between neutral and independent is this: neutral does not engage in any action that would normally be construed as working for or against the natives of the target region. That is why we are not militarily neutral, we are independent. Although we are neither R nor D, our actions that involve moving into a target region will inevitably be working either for the natives or against the natives, and that means we perform R and D actions whilst being of neither character, thus independent.

Unibot has often tried to debunk independence as a feasible stance, his argument goes that there is something greater to be gained from choosing a side. For us, I believe independence is working, but we risk limiting our future development if we do not seriously consider taking a side, and to that end I will insist on the magisterium taking the gameplay alignment test so that we know where we stand.
Edited by Babiana, May 30 2013, 12:07:57 PM.
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
81

A Slanted Black Stripe
May 29 2013, 07:21:46 PM
You have some intriguing ideas.

I'm surprised you support the legislation I introduced in the Magisterium, as it has not been very popular with anyone else. But I do thank you for the support.

I was not familiar with the Gameplay Alignment Test before reading your message. So I took the test and posted the results in the thread in our forum. Already there are quite a mix of responses.

How would you combine these scores to formulate a foreign policy?

I'm also surprised by your suggestion to eliminate the Conclave. Based on what I have seen, we have citizens who claim that actions of the Magisterium are in violation of the Concordat, but no one seems willing to present a case to the Conclave. I think the Conclave could be quite busy if the citizens utilized them.

If there were no Conclave, how would citizens challenge laws they thought were in violation of the Concordat? The Magisterium is not going to be an unbiased judge of its own actions.

Thanks.

I think it's good to enforce the roles that are being played. In our current structure we have clearly separate entities and they need to each remember what the other is there for. If we can no longer respect the separation then we ought to officially merge them to preserve their integrity.


Thank you so much for posting the test results, it was exciting to see our people appearing on the grid! Need more, to get a full picture.

I had in mind that the test questions would be answered visibly in the magisterium so that the answers from each question could be factored into our military policy.

The results without the answers is still interesting but it's not as useful as if we had the full answers.


Edit: in answer to your second question, citizens would appeal to the magisterium to review its own laws, it would need to rise to the challenge of objectively criticising its own judgement, which could be made easier by electing from among themselves a reviewer who would be most able to look at the question objectively. Also it would be possible to call expert witnesses into the review to help... and finally, citizens would be able appeal to the viziers to remove a magister who was denying a proper review to take place, as some body needs to retain this power in the absence of the conclave.

Whilst on paper it might seem like the conclave is the body to make it work, I'm taking the view that the last 9 months I have seen show that the conclave is not conducive to carrying out its functions and the region should look if maybe that should be changed now.
Edited by Babiana, May 30 2013, 01:04:30 PM.
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dimiou13
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Kilroy was here
Personally, I fully support you Babiana. You have at least one vote from me.

The Federal President of The Federal Republic of Neapolitan States, Magister of The East Pacific,
Dimiou Evangelos
The Federal Republic of Neapolitan States

The Official Webpage of The Federal Republic of Neapolitan States

The Federal President's official account for The Eastern Pacific's official forum.
By representing the people of The Federal Republic of Neapolitan States, The Federal President is:

Citizen of The East Pacific since 09/05/2013
Former Private of The Eastern Pacific Sovereign Army (E.P.S.A.) from 12/05/2013 to 05/01/2014
Former Magister of The East Pacific from 19/05/2013 to 09/01/2014

VERBA VOLANT, SCRIPTA MANENT


The Federal President of The Federal Republic of Neapolitan States, Former Magister of T.E.P. and Former Private of E.P.S.A.,
Dimiou Evangelos(you can call me Vangelis or dimiou13 )

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Samuel Kudrow
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Religious rituals and festivities....?

What, not everyone is religious, though I am I don't think this is the best way to go.


How will you stop Nazi spam?
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
Samuel Kudrow
May 30 2013, 03:33:24 PM
Religious rituals and festivities....?

What, not everyone is religious, though I am I don't think this is the best way to go.


How will you stop Nazi spam?
No we don't need the religion to be ours, we can pretend, you know, just like a roleplay.


Regarding Nazi Adspam:

The truth is we cannot stop Nazi adspam. This is an irritating truth but in the end it cannot be denied. Adspam and Nazis are as ingrained to NS as raiders and defenders.

But we can pretend that we can combat it. There is a lot we can do. As Delegate, I would have the power to suppress any Nazi adspam that appears on The East Pacific RMB so our citizens don't have to see it. As commander in chief of the EPSA I would have the power to move into regions that are blighted by these messages and suppress them, also, we can conduct raids against any region that has a connection with a Nazi Adspamming region, and close down their embassies. We have seen LCG respond to our actions already, which shows they do have an effect.

We could go much further though, we could declare war on GGR like the NPO have done. We could invent new ways to damage their capabilities. We could watch them, infiltrate them, see how they operate, learn to think like them in order to defeat them. The danger is he who fights with monsters must take care not to become a monster... and he who spies on Nazis gets spied on by Nazis.

So when this issue confronts us we must avoid the trap of allowing intolerant mentalities to corrupt our thoughts, that they do not lead us to ruin. As the harcesis child said, the only way to win is to deny the battle.
Edited by Babiana, May 30 2013, 04:47:40 PM.
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
dimiou13
May 30 2013, 02:10:13 PM
Personally, I fully support you Babiana. You have at least one vote from me.

The Federal President of The Federal Republic of Neapolitan States, Magister of The East Pacific,
Dimiou Evangelos
Thank you very much, your vote means a lot to me. :tu: :$
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A Slanted Black Stripe
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Quote:
 
We could invent new ways to damage their capabilities. We could watch them, infiltrate them, see how they operate, learn to think like them in order to defeat them. The danger is he who fights with monsters must take care not to become a monster... and he who spies on Nazis gets spied on by Nazis.


Let's focus on inventing new ways to damage their capabilities. What do you think are their weaknesses? What do they want? What do they value?
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
A Slanted Black Stripe
May 31 2013, 10:55:28 AM
Quote:
 
We could invent new ways to damage their capabilities. We could watch them, infiltrate them, see how they operate, learn to think like them in order to defeat them. The danger is he who fights with monsters must take care not to become a monster... and he who spies on Nazis gets spied on by Nazis.


Let's focus on inventing new ways to damage their capabilities. What do you think are their weaknesses? What do they want? What do they value?
I don't know, I generally keep away from them.

They seemed bothered by our attempt to disrupt their foreign affairs by closing an embassy, which seems to me as they are somewhat perfectionist.

The last time GGR suffered any real damage was when the NationStates game admin [violet] actually went as far as cheating, deleting the founder's nation in order to make the delegacy executive and allowing it to be raided.

Similarly, Nazi Europe was quite riled when the GCRs clubbed together to use a security council liberation proposal (which is supposed to be for protecting natives from raiders) to forcibly lift the password protection on the region and allow it to be raided.

If we are willing to for admins to break game rules and Lazarus delegates to strip the SC of any remaining credibility then I think we have to question what our stance really is all about.

87.
Edited by Babiana, May 31 2013, 01:04:08 PM.
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A Slanted Black Stripe
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No, I'm asking if there is something that can be done within the structure of the game. Can we create a coalition of a vast number of nations within Nation States to limit the nazis involvement in any aspect of the game? Would you as delegate lead such an effort?

Whatever happened to this? http://theeastpacific.com/single/?p=8000535&t=5162939

Would you renew these type of efforts?
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
A Slanted Black Stripe
May 31 2013, 02:15:45 PM
No, I'm asking if there is something that can be done within the structure of the game. Can we create a coalition of a vast number of nations within Nation States to limit the nazis involvement in any aspect of the game? Would you as delegate lead such an effort?

Whatever happened to this? http://theeastpacific.com/single/?p=8000535&t=5162939

Would you renew these type of efforts?
This is a tricky question, thanks for asking, because I struggled multiple times in answering it.

As you pointed out, a coalition has already been created.

I can't really deny that it is a way of dealing with the situation... I don't approve of it because of the way it chooses its targets and presents it as a moral justification. Raiding is part of the game, not about morals. Here is a quote from LWU:
Raiding Demystified

Being moral would be to do unto others as we would have them do to us. If The East Pacific spammed a UCR constantly, would we applaud them in overthrowing our government?

Another way of being both moral and anti-nazi would be to refrain from tagging the holocaust memorial... the duty of detagging and restoring it fell to the UDL last year.

So whilst I am at odds with the logic of that coalition, and not on great terms with the ex-feeder tyrants among them, I do still think they have some good intentions other than empowering their own club, they are at least trying to improve the state of the game, and so I wouldn't completely rule out that kind of co-operation. If I was elected delegate the realpolitik may leave no option but to join and support those efforts that you pointed to, but I remain skeptical.
Edited by Babiana, May 31 2013, 03:58:47 PM.
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East Malaysia
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You said you would close all in-game Embassies except for two. That could hurt Feeder-Sinker-UCR relations and put TEP in the position of choosing sides. Typically it is viewed as you have a forum embassy, you get an in-game embassy. If you did do that, how would you counter criticism?




General Question I will be asking the other Candidates

Based on the Concordat, do you believe Viziers should be allowed to serve in different branches of the government? The main reason of the role is regional security but it also puts them in a position where they can become WAD depending on the situation. Depending on your response... If yes: why? If no: what would you do to give that role more things to do?

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A mean old man
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I must say that I as well find that idea concerning. I cannot fathom such an action being condoned by those abroad whom it affects and I'm curious as to how you plan to go through with it (EDIT: the embassy closure idea).
Edited by A mean old man, Jun 2 2013, 09:14:26 PM.
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mcmasterdonia
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You spoke to me about this yesteraday, about the idea of closing all in-game embassies with the goal of moving away from close relationships with the GCRs and instead pursuing relationships with small RP regions.

I would like you to elaborate on this policy, specifically, why you believe (like you said to me yesterday) that alienation would be good for the East Pacific?
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Prussia
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No...I'm sorry, I cannot support you. I fully support the conclave. Of all of the relations to keep, you're going to keep the UDL's? Ridiculous. Also, its way to extreme to close all but 2 embassies.
PrussianEmpire
Former Delegate of The East Pacific

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Babiana
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The Candy Man
Apologies for late reply, I was at my parents and there is a technical ISP problem which prevents me from accessing the EP forum from there.
East Malaysia
Jun 1 2013, 03:41:26 PM
You said you would close all in-game Embassies except for two. That could hurt Feeder-Sinker-UCR relations and put TEP in the position of choosing sides. Typically it is viewed as you have a forum embassy, you get an in-game embassy. If you did do that, how would you counter criticism?




General Question I will be asking the other Candidates

Based on the Concordat, do you believe Viziers should be allowed to serve in different branches of the government? The main reason of the role is regional security but it also puts them in a position where they can become WAD depending on the situation. Depending on your response... If yes: why? If no: what would you do to give that role more things to do?

Thanks for your questions. To the first, let me clarify, I don't favour siding with Lazarus. Concordatly, we would have to void the existing treaty before we can close relations with them, that means it will take longer to reach a no relations stage with Lazarus than it will for the other GCRs where we have no formal treaty. I would counter that we are not choosing sides, we are choosing no sides. Indeed, in a situation where the GCRs are being pressured towards unity for unity's sake, neutrality is not a bad option. I don't want to see us alienating a friendly region in the name of GCR unity. We want to (and should) be warm and welcoming to anyone with even the faintest feederite affections, but we don't want them to tell us who we are simply because we are 'a GCR'. GCR stands for Game Created Region but our true heritage is we were founded by raiders in the Atlantic Alliance. The game converted us into a GCR. There are many in this game who can tell us more about our region, but in the end it is the natives of the EP who should be shaping its destiny and they need to be freed of formal ties in order to truly have a choice over TEP's place in the world. We'll go isolationist.

A mean old man
Jun 2 2013, 09:13:09 PM
I must say that I as well find that idea concerning. I cannot fathom such an action being condoned by those abroad whom it affects and I'm curious as to how you plan to go through with it (EDIT: the embassy closure idea).
I'm not sure what you mean by whom it affects. Other regions are not being deprived of a relationship with us, they are free to seek to re-establish a friendship, if it's what they want.

mcmasterdonia
Jun 3 2013, 01:37:52 AM
You spoke to me about this yesteraday, about the idea of closing all in-game embassies with the goal of moving away from close relationships with the GCRs and instead pursuing relationships with small RP regions.

I would like you to elaborate on this policy, specifically, why you believe (like you said to me yesterday) that alienation would be good for the East Pacific?
As you know, I am no good with RP. However, if there is interest from our people and volunteers willing to put in the work we could implement an RP requirement for foreign embassies (envoys have to roleplay their embassy to establish it). A bit like we have done for our map. It would take patience and some coaching but I think it's worth a try. It's also why we would have to begin with no formal foreign relations, to be fair to all regions.

Personally I think our foreign relations is a mess and we could force a rise in standards by combining it with RP. A lot of patience needed :)
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
Prussia
Jun 3 2013, 05:49:40 PM
No...I'm sorry, I cannot support you. I fully support the conclave. Of all of the relations to keep, you're going to keep the UDL's? Ridiculous. Also, its way to extreme to close all but 2 embassies.
I did not favour the the treaty with UDL when it was being proposed but as the ambassador I did what I thought was my duty to do and helped write it. We haven't got our way with UDL since Unibot left, but, in my view, and I hate to say it, TEP has not treated the UDL with respect. Many of us do not value the treaty, which is the only one that we have worked on since the days of the MPA. In April I had privately urged magisters to withdraw from the treaty but instead we stuck with it, not to our credit. I still favour closing relations with the UDL also, but concordatly, the treaty must be cancelled first.

In regards to the conclave, I respect your view and I will not be doing anything to the conclave, I was just positing an alternate structure. Reform is the prerogative of the Magisterium.

East Malaysia
Jun 1 2013, 03:41:26 PM
You said you would close all in-game Embassies except for two. That could hurt Feeder-Sinker-UCR relations and put TEP in the position of choosing sides. Typically it is viewed as you have a forum embassy, you get an in-game embassy. If you did do that, how would you counter criticism?




General Question I will be asking the other Candidates

Based on the Concordat, do you believe Viziers should be allowed to serve in different branches of the government? The main reason of the role is regional security but it also puts them in a position where they can become WAD depending on the situation. Depending on your response... If yes: why? If no: what would you do to give that role more things to do?

On the second question, the concordat forbids a person from being delegate and magister, arbiter and deleagte, or magister and arbiter, and I basically agree. I'm not worried about placing any further restriction on viziers being magisters or arbiters, I think that would be too restrictive. Unless the structure was being radically changed I don't think it is an issue. If the situation arose where I nominated a vizier to act as delegate in my stead, then they could still be magister or arbiter but if they personally saw a conflict of interest they could always resign one of the positions, however, I don't believe the conflict of interest would be severe enough to warrant it.

96
Edited by Babiana, Jun 3 2013, 06:11:14 PM.
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A Slanted Black Stripe
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I find the idea of a complete reset of foreign relationships a bit over the top. You, of course, are welcome to propose this and if enough citizens agree with you, we will see where it leads.

I was reminded of a Pablo Picasso quote recently, "Every act of creation is first an act of destruction." Perhaps this is you at your artistic best?

The Magisterium has removed two Arbiters recently. Todd has said he will not propose any new Arbiters during the remainder of his term. He will leave that for the next Delegate. Who would you nominate as new Arbiters? And if you are unwilling to name names, what process would you use to find new candidates?




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A Slanted Black Stripe
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What stripe?
Another appointment question.

Given existing law and recently passed legislation, who would you select for the following positions (or what process would you use)?

(1) Media Officer
(2) Tourism Officer
(3) Chancellor of the University of the East Pacific
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Babiana
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The Candy Man
A Slanted Black Stripe
Jun 3 2013, 06:47:55 PM
I find the idea of a complete reset of foreign relationships a bit over the top. You, of course, are welcome to propose this and if enough citizens agree with you, we will see where it leads.

I was reminded of a Pablo Picasso quote recently, "Every act of creation is first an act of destruction." Perhaps this is you at your artistic best?

The Magisterium has removed two Arbiters recently. Todd has said he will not propose any new Arbiters during the remainder of his term. He will leave that for the next Delegate. Who would you nominate as new Arbiters? And if you are unwilling to name names, what process would you use to find new candidates?




Oh, so that's why we have no new arbiters yet :)

In the event that I won the election... I would nominate Old Federalia for the conclave, since he publicly expressed an interest in it, and has recently left the magisterium of his own accord. I think he would be one of the most capable people in voicing an opinion and would keep Juris on his toes more than the last conclave.

I would like to nominate Lazlow also but I'm not sure if he'd be interested. (Lazlow if you're reading, is arbiter something you'd like to do?) As he's in charge of the map it's essential he stays active so I think if the conclave keeps him around more that will serve the map as well as the judiciary.

I would not nominate any of our current magisters as I think we need to retain as many magisters as possible so they can continue to work together on reform. If any expressed an interest I would consider them though.

I would also appoint ministers at random and assign them responsibilities, these would be intended only for the duration of the work and not permanent jobs. I'm quite excited about the ideas for those. On the other hand I would also be appointing Viziers for life, but would first review the situation with Reziel, East Malaysia, and of course Todd (who hopefully will revert to vizier after delegate, haven't had the right moment to ask him about that) :)

98
Edited by Babiana, Jun 3 2013, 07:59:29 PM.
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Samuel Kudrow
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NES w/8-track expansion
Prussia
Jun 3 2013, 05:49:40 PM
No...I'm sorry, I cannot support you. I fully support the conclave. Of all of the relations to keep, you're going to keep the UDL's? Ridiculous. Also, its way to extreme to close all but 2 embassies.
Vote for me then. :) I'm putting more things for the Conclave to do. :)
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