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[ALLI]Invasion of Heann; Recent Invasion
Topic Started: Jun 29 2005, 03:13:35 PM (612 Views)
Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Quote:
 

This invasion was without provocation, without any just cause. You are promoting the very same "imperialism" that your nation is against. This is what they're doing. Heann did shit to them. Not only do we have to provide peacekeeping, we have to restore the stability in this region.


There is stability. You're proposing combat with Vladistock, which would destroy the very stability you speak of.

Quote:
 
I agree with FPS on this point here, and I request that my earlier proposal be put to a vote.


Put it to a vote yourself; any members can create a poll.

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"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Free Pacific States
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Number One Drone
Krechzianko
Jul 19 2005, 08:44 PM
Quote:
 

This invasion was without provocation, without any just cause. You are promoting the very same "imperialism" that your nation is against. This is what they're doing. Heann did shit to them. Not only do we have to provide peacekeeping, we have to restore the stability in this region.


There is stability. You're proposing combat with Vladistock, which would destroy the very stability you speak of.

Yes, I'll give you that there is stability. But there are also reports of surrendured troops being killed, government members being arrested without charge, despite promises in the peace treaty, and illegal detainment of civilians. Don't tell me about stability: stability takes place when people don't die for no reason.
The Federated Alliance of Free Pacific States | Lyon Republic | Republic of Xiopothos | East Pacific Treaty Organization
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
All right. The vote on the resolution of action in Heann is unanimous, 5-0.

Therefore, by the results of the vote, we have agreed to the following:

Quote:
 

It looks like we agree to send in humanitarian aid, but military aid will also be needed for the following purposes:

1. Protect the humanitarian aid workers
2. Help distribute the aid
3. Provide other logistical services
4. Defend the civilian areas should Vlad attack more of them.

Amendment 1 to Heann EAF Action:
A. Humanitarian workers will be under the direction of a Krechziankan official, be it civilian or military.
B. Military troops serving in the EAF Heann forces will be under a Govindian military commander
C. Military troops shall not engage enemy forces outside the scope of either:
1. What is outlined in this Action
2. What is ordered by EPTO military officials and command
3. In their own self-defence.


With the above mentioned action voted on, let's move to discussing the coordination of this effort

Krechzianko, since you will be in charge of humanitarian efforts, what are you able to provide, and what assistance can my nation and the other EPTO nations present help you with? We still have the GRN's 7th Fleet in the region, so we would be able to send as many troops as you need to help with humanitarian aid. They would only carry their sidearms.

As for military efforts, what can each nation provide? I can send a regiment of troops, and provide necessary air support to them, or I can increase that number if need be. The commander of whatever forces I send will be the local EAF commander.

Comments anyone?
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
::bump for people's thoughts/respsonses::
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Krechzianko is HQ of the EPTO humanitarian wing, so we have quite a bit of resources at our disposal. While I have never come up with specific numbers, I'd assume that there are several thousand available aid workers at the very least. Any nation can contribute aid; EPTO workers under Krech command would simply distribute the supplies.

Military support should be minimal, perhaps a couple hundred Marines or ground troops. Food, clothing, and medical equipment would be useful aid to contribute, especially the latter.

Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Krechzianko
Jul 21 2005, 11:07 AM
Krechzianko is HQ of the EPTO humanitarian wing, so we have quite a bit of resources at our disposal.  While I have never come up with specific numbers, I'd assume that there are several thousand available aid workers at the very least.  Any nation can contribute aid; EPTO workers under Krech command would simply distribute the supplies.

Military support should be minimal, perhaps a couple hundred Marines or ground troops.  Food, clothing, and medical equipment would be useful aid to contribute, especially the latter.

All right. With the 500 troops in Vladistock Island, I have 59,500 troops available. Just tell me how many I can send for humanitarian work and that'll be fine.

As for military side, if you can send 200 troops, be it regulars or marines, that would be fine. Who would be in charge of this company of troops?

I will be sending in the 9th Expeditionary Unit, of 30,000 troops, under the command of Major General Stephanie Paxson. She will be the EAF-Heann commander.

Oh, and for future reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structure_of_...es_Armed_Forces
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
I know the size of units, thanks. I have been studying the military since I was three, you know. :rolleyes:

Anyway, 30,000 troops? I think not. There will be no need for troops to distribute supplies; that's why Krechzianko is sending humanitarian workers in the first place. Only a couple hundred troops will be needed total, to guard the workers. And remember the stipulation: no large-scale naval support, and no air support. I won't allow a massive military deployment in Heann under the guise of humanitarian aid.

Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Krechzianko
Jul 21 2005, 11:43 AM
I know the size of units, thanks.  I have been studying the military since I was three, you know. :rolleyes:

Anyway, 30,000 troops?  I think not.  There will be no need for troops to distribute supplies; that's why Krechzianko is sending humanitarian workers in the first place.  Only a couple hundred troops will be needed total, to guard the workers.  And remember the stipulation: no large-scale naval support, and no air support.  I won't allow a massive military deployment in Heann under the guise of humanitarian aid.

you misinterpreted. The 30,000 was going to be for the military side, the peacekeeping.

As for the humanitarian side, would you be willing to let me send some of my marines to help, or if not troops, i could send some sailors from one of my warship to provide logistical, medical, an humanitarian support in that regard?

oh and the reference link was for everyone, not just for you or me.
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Okay, I think we have a misunderstanding here. I'm under this impression:

-Several hundred to a couple thousand Krech non-military aid workers to distribute supplies to citizens.

-A couple hundred Govindian troops to guard workers and protect supplies, with no significant support from the sea or air. That's all. No 30,000 troops or anything, no peacekeeping, just guarding the aid workers.

You're under the impression that it will be:

-Krech aid workers to distribute aid.

-Govindian troops to distribute aid (I'm opposed to this one).

-Govindian troops to guard distribution.


Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
The peacekeeping troops would be sent to carry out the military duties outline in the action voted upon. These would fall under the command of a Govindian officer.

The humanitarian portion of this action is under your wing. I offered to send sailors, or have a ship be used for logistical, aid, or medical purposes, if you wont let me use military troops armed with only a sidearm. Wounded people can be treated there.

I'm not sure what you're not understanding here.
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Quote:
 
As Krechzianko holds the position of humanitarian aid manager, and because Krechzianko is an ally of Vladistock, we would prefer that any operations be run by Krech aid workers. Govindian soldiers could be sent in in small numbers (no air or large-scale naval support), but could not engage in combat operation unless:

1) defending themselves
2) given specific orders from EPTO command


That was my condition for voting yes. If you consider 30,000 men a 'small number' of troops, we have very different views on what a small number is.

Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
That was not the condition you agreed to. You voted yes for the following conditions:

Quote:
 
It looks like we agree to send in humanitarian aid, but military aid will also be needed for the following purposes:

1. Protect the humanitarian aid workers
2. Help distribute the aid
3. Provide other logistical services
4. Defend the civilian areas should Vlad attack more of them.

Amendment 1 to Heann EAF Action:
A. Humanitarian workers will be under the direction of a Krechziankan official, be it civilian or military.
B. Military troops serving in the EAF Heann forces will be under a Govindian military commander
C. Military troops shall not engage enemy forces outside the scope of either:
1. What is outlined in this Action
2. What is ordered by EPTO military officials and command
3. In their own self-defence
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Quote:
 
1. Protect the humanitarian aid workers
2. Help distribute the aid
3. Provide other logistical services
4. Defend the civilian areas should Vlad attack more of them.


Do you seriously feel that thousands of men are necessary for such tasks?

Also:

Quote:
 
As Krechzianko holds the position of humanitarian aid manager, and because Krechzianko is an ally of Vladistock, we would prefer that any operations be run by Krech aid workers. Govindian soldiers could be sent in in small numbers (no air or large-scale naval support), but could not engage in combat operation unless:

1) defending themselves
2) given specific orders from EPTO command

Change the proposal and I will gladly vote 'yes'.


I clearly indicated that, should you change the proposal to fit in with my requests, I would give a 'yes' vote. Let's not get bogged down in obscure details of the language we used; if you twist my words to allow 30,000 troops to be sent, I will have to switch my vote and, should it be necessary, sent my own soldiers to assist Vladistock in defending Heann from Govindian aggression.

Krechzianko is glad to send humanitarian aid, and we would be saddened if this agreement was destroyed due to the wording of a proposal. We would prefer that the operation was carried out with the necessary military force, rather than a full Corps of Marines. That is a totally unnecessary use of power.

Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
whoa, hold on there, before I say anything, I'd like to hear what the other nations half to say on this.
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Agreed. As I said, I'd rather not do anything rash before we can reach a decision, but I hope that you'll realize: thousands upon thousands of troops is far too large a force for this operation.

Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Gnidrah
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Former Delegate
Krechzianko
Jul 21 2005, 12:55 PM
Agreed. As I said, I'd rather not do anything rash before we can reach a decision, but I hope that you'll realize: thousands upon thousands of troops is far too large a force for this operation.

Agreed.
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Krechzianko
Jul 21 2005, 01:55 PM
Agreed. As I said, I'd rather not do anything rash before we can reach a decision, but I hope that you'll realize: thousands upon thousands of troops is far too large a force for this operation.

I know. The EAF forces under the command of one of my officers will have their ROE tailored to the action voted upon. And I only proposed an entire RMEU at first because I did not know exactly how many Vlad troops were present in Heann, and I was thinking worst case scenario....
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Gnidrah, FPS, Xio, any thoughts on what was said today?
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Krechzianko
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Dictator of the Proletariat
Well, should such a scenario take place, we could quickly deploy more troops without the need to position them in Heann from the outset. That's what the EAF is for.

Also, Vladistock would not attack Krech ad workers. It would be a foolish move on Vlad's part to do so, and he would not oppose the sending of humanitarian aid.

Posted Image

"Not only does [Krech] have the tongue of a diplomat but a groove the ladies swoon over."
-Soul Cancer

"Krechziankans are known to simply disregard information to blow the shit outa someone they don't like." -FPS

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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Krechzianko
Jul 21 2005, 02:03 PM
Well, should such a scenario take place, we could quickly deploy more troops without the need to position them in Heann from the outset. That's what the EAF is for.

Also, Vladistock would not attack Krech ad workers. It would be a foolish move on Vlad's part to do so, and he would not oppose the sending of humanitarian aid.

i'm also concerned about any aid workers from other nations, including mine.

But, let's wait for what the others have to say.
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Free Pacific States
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Number One Drone
We should provide our humanitarian workers with protection. If not from the Vladistockians (who are known to..dislike..the Govindians), then from rebel forces which may seek to use them as hostages or means of gathering supplies.
The Federated Alliance of Free Pacific States | Lyon Republic | Republic of Xiopothos | East Pacific Treaty Organization
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Free Pacific States
Jul 21 2005, 03:55 PM
We should provide our humanitarian workers with protection. If not from the Vladistockians (who are known to..dislike..the Govindians), then from rebel forces which may seek to use them as hostages or means of gathering supplies.

could you be specific in terms of numbers and everything?
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Free Pacific States
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Number One Drone
Not at this point. We don't know how much humanitarian relief is required, and thus, we don't know how many people were sending. And we can't know how many people we're sending to protect our humanitarian aid workers if we don't know how many humanitarian aid workers were sending.
The Federated Alliance of Free Pacific States | Lyon Republic | Republic of Xiopothos | East Pacific Treaty Organization
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Gnidrah
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Former Delegate
Well, that's one way to put it. :)
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
All right then, let's discuss what's the situation in Heann currently.

Anyone care to give us a status on what's going on there?
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
um...hello????
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Free Pacific States
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Number One Drone
OOC: Eh, no reason to figure out specifics, Gov. I mean, unless you want to, we can just say were sending a non-specific number of people. If you'd like a specific number, though, the island has a population of 35k or so...maybe 500, plus military guards?
The Federated Alliance of Free Pacific States | Lyon Republic | Republic of Xiopothos | East Pacific Treaty Organization
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Republic of Govindia
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The Fluffy Horde
Free Pacific States
Jul 28 2005, 06:10 PM
OOC: Eh, no reason to figure out specifics, Gov. I mean, unless you want to, we can just say were sending a non-specific number of people. If you'd like a specific number, though, the island has a population of 35k or so...maybe 500, plus military guards?

No, I mean what's the status of the situation in heann. How many troops are on each side, etc.

The whole shebang...that way we can decide numbers and finally get some decisive action on this, more than just mere words.
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